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New Fire Emblem game just months away! Echoes! Let's talk about it!

scorpio_7scorpio_7 Tactics Ogre, I choose u!Full Members
Ok - let's talk about Fire Emblem Echoes. I was blown away to hear today that there is a new Fire Emblem game coming out in just 4 months. First I had heard about it.

What are peoples thoughts on the game? The fact that it is a remake of Gaiden - and that obviously many features in the current gen of fire emblem won't be present. The fact that it is different from what we are used to now - definitely intrigues me.

Thoughts?
Check out my writing and art by following this link to my work: www.stevenmouland.com

Comments

  • ChickenGodChickenGod Overdosing Heavenly Bliss Moderators
    edited January 29
    I was surprised that its coming so soon, too. That being said, I'm a little apprehensive about its quality.

    For one, I just didn't like Fates all that much, it was supposed to be Fire Emblem's main series heavy hitter, and it didn't live up to what I was expecting. More importantly though, I straight up disliked Shadow Dragon's take on the remake. Its still my least favorite FE I've ever played, granted I haven't tried many of the older non-english titles. Echoes being another remake has me similarly worried, though I admit this one looks a lot better than Shadow Dragon did.

    Theres some cool features that I think will be fun, such as walking around towns and what looks to be Arc The Lad style random encounters. Using a similar style in art and graphics as Awakening and Fates is good, I like how these games look, but I have to admit I'm not too keen on the design of the main characters.

    I know I've been more negative here than I'd like to be, but I'll certainly be renting Echoes and keeping an open mind on playing it. I'm expecting a solid above average SRPG with a twist experience, I think it'll be fairly fun. I'm more excited for the Switch FE since I really liked the Gamecube and Wii titles, but this should serve as a nice go-between and I'm really happy to see the FE series being pushed into the limelight by Nintendo.
  • GaijinMonogatariGaijinMonogatari RPGamer Staff RPGamer Staff
    If you want to try some of the older games and feel a bit masochistic, I know a place that had a copy of Thracia 776 in the display case a few months back. I could always check to see if it's still there.
  • jscarpejscarpe RPGamer Staff RPGamer Staff
    I'm excited for a remake of Gaiden. Ever since Awakening came out a few years ago (and I got sucked into Fire Emblem), I've been slowly going through some of the earlier games so it's nice to have an easy way to play this one without hunting down a fan translation. Also, after playing some of the pre-Awakening games, I'm looking forward to a Fire Emblem that focuses more on the strategy and less on the periphery (marriage, kids etc.).
  • TheAnimeManTheAnimeMan Member Full Members
    I remember playing this as my first intro to Fire Emblem as fan translation back in 94.
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    28 years of gaming and still going strong
    and now a mostly annoyed Father with first son. And now a father again to a second son :D

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  • ClixClix Listmaster Full Members
    ChickenGod wrote: »
    I was surprised that its coming so soon, too. That being said, I'm a little apprehensive about its quality.

    For one, I just didn't like Fates all that much, it was supposed to be Fire Emblem's main series heavy hitter, and it didn't live up to what I was expecting. More importantly though, I straight up disliked Shadow Dragon's take on the remake. Its still my least favorite FE I've ever played, granted I haven't tried many of the older non-english titles. Echoes being another remake has me similarly worried, though I admit this one looks a lot better than Shadow Dragon did.

    Theres some cool features that I think will be fun, such as walking around towns and what looks to be Arc The Lad style random encounters. Using a similar style in art and graphics as Awakening and Fates is good, I like how these games look, but I have to admit I'm not too keen on the design of the main characters.

    I know I've been more negative here than I'd like to be, but I'll certainly be renting Echoes and keeping an open mind on playing it. I'm expecting a solid above average SRPG with a twist experience, I think it'll be fairly fun. I'm more excited for the Switch FE since I really liked the Gamecube and Wii titles, but this should serve as a nice go-between and I'm really happy to see the FE series being pushed into the limelight by Nintendo.

    Well, it's too early to say, but the last Fire Emblem remake was remarkable: New Mystery of the Emblem. Unfortunately, said remake happened at the end of the DS's lifespan AND during the middle of NoA's "JRPGs suck" phase. Oh, and it is a direct sequel to Shadow Dragon, which received internally middling reception. Thanks to the dedication of Fire Emblem's fan translators, a very good translation exists for FE3(DS).

    Now, it is built on the same engine that they used for Shadow Dragon, but it's added content was significantly more worthwhile. For starters, the murder-the-spares mechanic was removed for unlocking Gaiden chapters--instead, invisible conditions a la the GBA games came back. Furthermore, the added prologue is not merely a tutorial that is locking into Easy Mode; the first ten or so chapters introduce the majority of the new characters, including Kris/My Unit (yep, that was NOT a new idea for Awakening; it came from FE3's remake). The game features tons of invisible supports and conversations for the pre-battle base segment, giving the cast for 78 recruit-able characters their time to shine throughout the game. Also, another presumably Awakening-original idea comes from the remake: Casual Mode. This can be a bit of a godsend as it is most certainly not easy to recruit everyone. Finally, the reclass system from FE1's remake returns, allowing you to adjust your strategy on the fly (like turning your pre-promote Paladins into Wyvern Lords when you need extra mobility).

    While it's fine to be wary, especially after how lackluster Fates was, Echoes most likely won't be as dry as Shadow Dragon, unless Intelligent Systems has really started to backpedal as a developer.
    ClixPsi.png
  • ChickenGodChickenGod Overdosing Heavenly Bliss Moderators
    edited February 6
    Its funny you mention the fan translation of Mystery of the Emblem, as the release of Fire Emblem Heroes inspired me to try out the fan translation of FE6. I don't have a phone and I don't really have a strong desire to seek out a way to play FE:H, but I really liked a couple of characters I saw there, namely Fir and Cecilia. Plus it just looks like a short and easy game to complete. I'll try to keep my mind open in the future for Mystery of the Emblem, Clix.

    Speaking of characters, they've actually become a fairly big reason for my enjoyment of FE in general. Typically Fire Emblem doesn't get much personality development, but everything from design, their class, quirks, and how they handle in game is something that draws me to the series. Of the few shown in Echoes, none of them really caught my eye, but I'll be interested to see how they're redesigned from Gaiden and how much supports play a role this time around.
  • TheAnimeManTheAnimeMan Member Full Members
    Well Gaiden had multiple paths and replayable maps (which was pretty unique for SRPG's back in NES days) The really big issue was healing used up the casters health.
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    28 years of gaming and still going strong
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  • ClixClix Listmaster Full Members
    ChickenGod wrote: »
    Its funny you mention the fan translation of Mystery of the Emblem, as the release of Fire Emblem Heroes inspired me to try out the fan translation of FE6. I don't have a phone and I don't really have a strong desire to seek out a way to play FE:H, but I really liked a couple of characters I saw there, namely Fir and Cecilia. Plus it just looks like a short and easy game to complete. I'll try to keep my mind open in the future for Mystery of the Emblem, Clix.

    Speaking of characters, they've actually become a fairly big reason for my enjoyment of FE in general. Typically Fire Emblem doesn't get much personality development, but everything from design, their class, quirks, and how they handle in game is something that draws me to the series. Of the few shown in Echoes, none of them really caught my eye, but I'll be interested to see how they're redesigned from Gaiden and how much supports play a role this time around.

    I do not want to discourage you, but I think it's best that you have a bit of an idea of what you are getting yourself into.

    The Binding Blade is the third hardest Fire Emblem game, behind Radiant Dawn and Thracia 776 (contention can be made for the first three being harder, but their difficulties come more from archaic design choices that are largely remedied by the remakes).

    Now, I will let you know why this game is so hard. More often than not, the good units are the second, severely underleveled characters you get mid-game, not the characters that you start with. And when I say underleveled, I mean underleveled. You get three great units on Ch 8 at level 1. Furthermore, Roy is the worse lord in the series in direct combat prior to promoting; the problem is that Roy is a story-promote in the THIRD TO LAST CHAPTER (unless you unlock the extended ending maps, see below). This means you have to spend the second half of the game baby-sitting Roy, who is naturally not optional. This can lead to a case of your team essentially being a gaggle of Magikarps being led by a Larvesta.

    Next, the game features an exceeding nightmarish feature: Enemy reinforcements arrive at the start of the enemy phase AND move on the turn that they arrive. All enemy reinforcements are Wyvern Riders/Lords--from behind. You practically have to rely on a moving box formation to avoid your squishy backline from dying.

    Finally, there are a number of Gaiden chapters in this game, but the prerequisites are not spelled out (let alone on which maps). However, you must play all Gaiden chapters to unlock the extended ending. Each Gaiden chapter yields a holy weapon, but holy weapons only have 20 uses--if the weapon is used up before being Ch 23, then you cannot get the extended ending even if you did all of the Gaiden chapters. Also, for the holy weapons, this includes the one story-given item, the titular sword that promotes Roy (also 20 uses; the Falchion/Ragnel it is not). Finally, your manakete must still be alive (her ONE stone is also 20 uses--seeing a pattern?); she will be mandatory for the extra maps.

    Lastly, click on the below spoiler box if you would like any helpful insight on character comparisons:
    Cavalier: Noah>Allen=Lance>Treck - Noah is balanced while Allen is strength and Lance is speed; Treck has defense but not much else; I would say Noah is best due to his supports with Fir.
    Archer: Wolt=Dorothy - Fairly equal and both have good support options (Roy for Wolt, Saul for Dorothy)
    Knight: Wendy>Bors>Barth - Wendy starts weak but grows deadly; Bors is just average; Barth only has HP and defense
    Cleric: Saul>Ellen - Ellen really only has Resistence, while Saul is all-around, making him far more useful down the line when he gains Light Magic
    Mercenary: Oujay>Dieck - Dieck has ludicrously good bases but not growths, while Oujay has bad bases but great growth; Oujay can also support with Wendy, making them unstoppable.
    Fighter: Wade=Lot - Both are okay; there are better axe-using jobs, quite frankly
    Pegasus Knight: Thany>Tate - Thany cannot use heavy spears, but she is crazy fast and hits fairly hard; she can fairly reliable even dodge arrows, even shortly after you get her; Tate joins way too late and is not really all that much better.
    Thief: Chad>Astol=Cath - Chad is one of the best units, but Thieves do not promote; the other two are just not useful except for opening chests; at level 20, Chad can still protentionally take out low-level promoted units
    Mage: Lilina>Lugh - Lilina will max magic very early, since he will likely get a magic point each level. Her other stats are mediocre, but her easy-to-achieve A Support with Roy (as in doable within three consecutive maps) covers up her holes, and, hey, standing next to Lilina to make her broken at least gives Roy something to do mid-game; that said Lugh is good, just not potentially broken
    Troubador: Clarine - While no real competition, it's good to know that she is likely the best healer; she has the best dodge rate in the game.
    Myrmidon: Fir>Rutger - Like Dieck, Rutger is good, but Fir is better. She starts weak but will quickly explode into a murder-machine. Also, this game gives Swordmasters a base crit rate of 30%, not 15%.
    Nomad: Shin>Sue - Both are very deadly and arguably better bow users than the two Archers.
    Brigand/Pirate: Geese>Gonzalez - Geese is highly reliable, while Gonzalez is Lilina in axe form (they can even support!). Gonzalez's crazy luck combined with his 30% crit rate as a Berserker can actually work fairly reliably for kills, but Geese is less likely to result in your turn being waste. That said, both are better than Wade and Lot, so these two are your go-to axe users if you don't mind waiting until the mid-point.
    Shaman: Ray>Sophia - Ray, like Lugh, is very well-rounded; Sophia almost seems like she would then be Lilina to Ray's Lugh, but she never goes anywhere. She also joins ludicrously late at level 1.
    Wyvern Rider: Miledy>Zeiss - Technically, they are completely equal, but Zeiss is one of the last unpromoted units to join, so Miledy edges out by availability
    ClixPsi.png
  • Strawberry EggsStrawberry Eggs Wannabe Mistborn Lucario Administrators
    edited February 11
    I'm pretty excited for this. I've been curious about FE Gaiden and even wanted to try it, despite being archaic. The unique aspects of it like being able to explore towns and dungeons sounded intriguing, and it's the source of many gameplay mechanics that wouldn't show up until later in the series like a third tier of promotions, branching promotions, unbreakable weapons and a world map. I thought we wouldn't get a remake since Intelligent System went from remaking the first game to the third one. I'm glad I was wrong. :)

    I'm going to guess they aren't going to put an Avatar/My Unit into Shadows of Valentia, but we'll see. :p
    Bravely second...
    The courage to try again...

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  • ChickenGodChickenGod Overdosing Heavenly Bliss Moderators
    edited February 10
    I appreciate the warning Clix, as I didnt expect Binding Blade to be note worthy in anyway. I'm using a guide to make sure I don't miss recruiting any characters and just been taking it easy, doing like 1 chapter a day or less. If it can't hold my interest, which is possible given I haven't been too enamored with the early maps, I'll just drop it and not worry about it. Compared to Awakening on Lunatic this doesn't seem that bad by comparison, but I certainly don't want to level up a bunch of low level units much later in the game or get surprise assassinated either. Really impressed you remember that much about the characters, hopefully some of the ones you listed end up being superior units since I have a history of FE not really following the predestined statistics much. Example: Supposedly Astrid is trash tier and Chrom has good growths, yet the complete opposite happened.

  • scorpio_7scorpio_7 Tactics Ogre, I choose u! Full Members
    I'm fairly sure I heard that magic will not be using up casters health anymore. I believe someone some where said that was verified by one of the screenshots (but I could be wrong).
    Check out my writing and art by following this link to my work: www.stevenmouland.com
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