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Final Fantasy XIII Spoiler Thread

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Comments

  • NevegaNevega Where's the Casino??? Full Members
    edited June 2010
    I've been playing FF13 for nearly 40 hours and I really have no clue as to what the story is even about or what is going on.

    As much as I've gone back and forth on how I feel about the game I just came to this realization and it's somewhat dissappointing.

    I mean I can understand some of what's happened I guess but if you were to ask me to explain the story so far I don't know if I could... That is not a good thing.

    It's also annoying how all the characters make those "shocked" or "surprised" sounds/noises every time a villain is talking or when something happens.

    I plan on finishing the game but I'm starting to get pretty irritated.
    CURRENTLY PLAYING:
    Grand Kingdom
    Xenoblade Chronicles X

  • SiliconNooBSiliconNooB Member Full Members
    edited June 2010
    Everything was too bad for me to keep playing, especially the story.
    Lusipurr.com: One man's monument to himself!
    9 out of 10 Dentists recomend UNDERBOOB!
  • NevegaNevega Where's the Casino??? Full Members
    edited June 2010
    Everything was too bad for me to keep playing, especially the story.
    This was prompted by someone asking me "hey, whats that game about?" and me having no real way to answer...

    "uh... well there's these fal'cie and la'cie and uhhh... people turn to crystal..."

    eh.gif
    CURRENTLY PLAYING:
    Grand Kingdom
    Xenoblade Chronicles X

  • TyphaonTyphaon Member Full Members
    edited June 2010
    That just tells me that either you aren't paying any attention, or you just don't care. I'm not defending the story because it's sloppy and bad. The story might be sloppy and ill conceived but it is pretty simple and relatively easy to follow even if following it gets you nowhere.
    What I have seen and done to achieve my position defies belief. What I am capable of and will be party to in order to retain it would chill your soul.
  • SiliconNooBSiliconNooB Member Full Members
    edited June 2010
    From what I could tell the story was just a holding pattern, padding out the linear corridor until you reached hour 60, and could stop playing.
    Lusipurr.com: One man's monument to himself!
    9 out of 10 Dentists recomend UNDERBOOB!
  • Confessor RahlConfessor Rahl Member Full Members
    edited June 2010
    I've been playing FF13 for nearly 40 hours and I really have no clue as to what the story is even about or what is going on.
    This made me laugh, as it concisely summarizes my exact same feelings at this moment. "WTF is happening here?!!"
    "Back when FF9 was coming out. People were rejoicing because it was actually a fantasy game and not a sci-fi game like 7 and 8. It's hilarious in modern context, with everyone wanking themselves to dehydration at the thought of a FF7 remake."
  • NevegaNevega Where's the Casino??? Full Members
    edited June 2010
    That just tells me that either you aren't paying any attention, or you just don't care. I'm not defending the story because it's sloppy and bad. The story might be sloppy and ill conceived but it is pretty simple and relatively easy to follow even if following it gets you nowhere.
    I care seeing as I continue to play the game but it shouldn't be this hard to get into a story... In any medium, let alone a game.

    I'm sure If i really made a effort I could figure it all out but that's just it... I shouldn't have to.

    I'm not saying I can't appreciate a deep, complex story but this just seems like nonsense piled on top of more nonsense with no real intricacy.

    I've never seen such a disjointed plot.
    CURRENTLY PLAYING:
    Grand Kingdom
    Xenoblade Chronicles X

  • flamethrowerflamethrower Member Full Members
    edited June 2010
    I for one cannot appreciate a deep complex story. It ends up being too complicated for me.

    Zelda
    Someone: Please help us Link! This dark king (or Ganon or whatever) already has/ will plunge our world into darkness! The only thing that can stop him is if you collect these X artifacts which are somehow scattered throughout Hyrule's dungeons!

    This type of story, while not making any sense, is simple enough for me to understand. More complicated that that is no good. And please don't tell your tale out-of-order. This serves to make things more confusing.

    Don't even get me started with Xenogears. That story has far too many moving parts and too much O-O-E (out of order execution) to be comprehensible.



  • RainaRaina Member Full Members
    edited June 2010
    I stopped playing. I understand what the story is, but frankly in spite of my best efforts of wanting to like the game, I found myself sorely disappointed. Sure the music is pretty, and the artwork is gorgeous, but the unbalanced difficulty level had me wanting to tear out my hair. It made me feel as if they didn't want to involve us (the game players) at all and just wanted to show off what they could do with their story driven game. I love the Final Fantasy series and I really was excited about this until I started playing it. They dropped the ball on this one.
  • SiliconNooBSiliconNooB Member Full Members
    edited June 2010
    It was a Saturday morning cartoon of a story with unrealistic characters which kept you at arms length ...
    Lusipurr.com: One man's monument to himself!
    9 out of 10 Dentists recomend UNDERBOOB!
  • NevegaNevega Where's the Casino??? Full Members
    edited June 2010
    You can't have a story with a bunch of bizarre terms and ideas that are left vague and mostly-unexplained. There needs to be better narration and a stronger sense of what the goal(s) really are and who the main villain is. The Eidolons are out of place and goofy with poor explainations as well. And they're next to useless in battle.

    The more i talk about this game the more I realize is wrong with it.

    Square needs to get back to basics with FF15.
    CURRENTLY PLAYING:
    Grand Kingdom
    Xenoblade Chronicles X

  • RebochanRebochan Who needs Rinoa anyway? Full Members
    edited June 2010
    Merged topic to relevant thread. Please, do we really need even more threads where the usual suspects get another excuse to beat into our skulls that they REALLY HATE FFXIII?
    "One original thought is worth a thousand mindless quotings." -- Diogenes
  • NevegaNevega Where's the Casino??? Full Members
    edited June 2010
    Merged topic to relevant thread. Please, do we really need even more threads where the usual suspects get another excuse to beat into our skulls that they REALLY HATE FFXIII?
    I don't hate the game by any means... It was more of just a funny observation.
    CURRENTLY PLAYING:
    Grand Kingdom
    Xenoblade Chronicles X

  • ScionUltimateScionUltimate New Member Full Members
    edited June 2010
    Am I the only one who doesn't care if FFXIII has towns or not, when so many RPG towns/cities lately have become giant sprawling nothingness? I guess it could be argued that it makes them seem more realistic, but I'm pretty over the pointless townspeople who 75% of the time can't even be spoken to anymore, and the other 25% dither on about absolutely nothing.

    If designers can't put in towns that are actually interesting I'm okay with them just removing them entirely.
    We might as well just get rid of all the NPCs while were at it then too. laugh.gif
    "Final Fantasy X's story may be linear but it has several "large" branching paths which lead to different places and sometimes to the same goal. Final Fantasy XIII does not really have much of anything like this until you get to Gran Pulse where the main field opens up and then it branches out in a few directions and you can cross the main field numerous ways to get to the same destination."
    Wait right there, are you talking about Hironobu Sakaguchi's Final Fantasy X? You must be joking. laugh.gif

    Final Fantasy X is one of the most linear, predictable games I have ever seen or played. I may love it, yet to deny its linearity and cookie cutter formula which it is birthed by would be the definition of stupidity. I own this game and have played it through to the end more times than I care to remember. It does not even have towns. It has villages and a few famous landmarks, exactly like FF13.
    Quote: wrote:
    "Final Fantasy X's story may be linear but it has several "large" branching paths which lead to different places and sometimes to the same goal."
    biggrin.gif biggrin.gif biggrin.gif Do you mean when you suddenly go off in the airship and visit a few different areas during the main story, which you otherwise can avoid entirely? Because those are a joke! Absolutely no part of this quote even resembles the truth.

    The "Weapon bosses" you fight are nothing but side-distractions. These so called paths FFX puts you on aren't even paths at all, because you can skip them right after you get into Spira's world map. You can pass right by them instead of fighting some creature; and none of them lead to game-changing events NOR do they alter the story at all.

    Not even Wakka's sports fetish is really a branching path, since at no point are you forced to go off and complete his side quest. The terms you used are impossible for this game to even fit the definition for. Branching paths are like Baldurs Gate and Knights of the Old Republic!

    There is absolutely none of that in FF 10, zero. The interactivity is so limited that you either complete the linear story, letting it hold your hand, or you run off and do the mission distractions before turning the game off. Period.

    On top of all this, FF 13 really IS NOT much different from FF 10 at all. Both require monotonous grinding. You are speaking complete nonsense. And FF10's battle system actually is littered with grinding in the final chapter, so much so that if you ever even want to get the complete story you have to torture yourself in the grinding fest that is the Monster Arena!

    Thankfully I love that place. Anyone else without patience would just shut the disk off. FF13 has a place very similar to this and it has a similar sphere grid. The linearity is palpable, but that is a strength for FF13. I get you have quite a satirical opinion of the FF games.

    But before you go spouting off yet again, here's my main suggestion:
    - Replay FF 10 in its entirety, so you learn what the game is. That thing is so linear its like watching a movie.
    - Play FF 13 all the way through, to likewise learn what the game is. It plays nearly identical if not very similar to FF 10.
    - Play FF8, followed by FF9 to learn why those games are the complete OPPOSITE of FF 10 in every conceivable way! And then understand the battle system, since it plays in an Active system that is completely backwards from what is used in FF 13.

    Then after doing that, retract your hilarious statement about FF 13 being a "grinding" game. I have never heard such laughable comments. Every FF in existence is a grinding game because RPGs involve grinding. FF 13 has a few more spots than the usual RPG, big deal! That has absolutely nothing to do with quality.



  • ScionUltimateScionUltimate New Member Full Members
    edited June 2010
    Using the review scores on Amazon, a site that accepts reviews from anyone and of any quality, really isn't a good way to get an honest take on the newest iteration of a series as divisive as Final Fantasy. Trolls are out in force for this series. The fact that there's over 1300 reviews for FFXIII proves that in itself, as it's really doubtful all of those reviews are of any quality.
    The active carpet-bombing of Spore's Amazon rating by gamers angry over SecuROM should've been a good reason not to pay attention to Amazon reviews for future high-profile releases.

    Or the continued trolling (via ratings inflation) of the infamous 3 Wolf t-shirt.
    There's nothing outlandish like that on any of the Japanese Final Fantasy XIII reviews I read but I guess some people in the U.S. love their wolf t-shirts enough to write big articles like that... rock.gif
    You are just incredibly rich. Sarcasm does not phase you. laugh.gif
  • ScionUltimateScionUltimate New Member Full Members
    edited June 2010
    MegaLink, I really hope your entire source of "Japanese opinion" isn't yourself and 2chan.

    I just doubt the ability of a single fan to accurately gauge something as broad as, I don't know, millions of people.
    Did you read any of the reviews on the Amazon link I posted a few days ago? 55% of the people think the game is mediocre to downright horrible and there's almost 1400 reviews on Amazon to choose from. The majority of the people don't have a lot of nice things to say about Final Fantasy XIII except the graphics and movie scenes look nice including people who gave the game 4 and 5 stars (which in some cases I find a little odd to be giving 5 stars to a game when the reviewer says the battle system is terrible). That's kind of sad if you ask me...
    I guess I am to take there is well over 50% of your clones running around then. laugh.gif

    Some people disliked it for doing what it does best, does not equate to half the japanese press. You learned that just about the same way you learned how the game FF10 was designed.
  • Alex FullerAlex Fuller Managing Editor RPGamer Staff
    edited June 2010
    When I read that thing about branching paths, I figure that means at least you can take more than one route to get to a place/go through a dungeon, or there's actually some 'fake' routes. I've yet to see at bit in FF13 (think my hour count was something like 15?) which has a branch of more than about 20 metres*. You go this way. And this way only.

    Disclaimer - speaking from memory, may be slightly incorrect.
    "Time is an illusion. Lunchtime doubly so."
    Twitter: severinmira | Xbox Live: Severin Mira | PSN: severinmira (EU) | NNID: severinmira
    Final Fantasy XIV: Sevvi Taubemira (Leviathan)
  • ScionUltimateScionUltimate New Member Full Members
    edited June 2010
    When I read that thing about branching paths, I figure that means at least you can take more than one route to get to a place/go through a dungeon, or there's actually some 'fake' routes. I've yet to see at bit in FF13 (think my hour count was something like 15?) which has a branch of more than about 20 metres*. You go this way. And this way only.

    Disclaimer - speaking from memory, may be slightly incorrect.
    I don't think you can count going around a big rock, rather than going THROUGH it really even a branching path. And that's all I remember in FF10, was hiking either around some rocks or traveling down the middle chute of those same rocks.

    In my understanding Lost Odyssey is actually an RPG with some branching paths, and not many at that. FF13 does have more than a few areas where you have to travel around something rather than go directly through it, both before you play for 15 hours & shortly afterward. But these don't lead to different outcomes at all.

    Heck, the only japanese RPG in recent memory that truly exhibited countless branching paths was Chrono Cross. I'm surprised no one mentioned this. But it came out so long ago that everyone forgets it. There in that game, you could do countless branching storyline paths that lead to different endings.

    Some people praised the game for those features, while others hated it for the same. Long story short, Square never made another Chrono so one of those two audiences won out. Japanese RPGs in general are very linear with not a whole lot of NPC conversation, with the discussions between party members FF13 actually might be more interactive than FF10 was. But even then, I see the games being identical in many areas as it pertains to linear forced level design. You are pushed down a pre-set path, allowed to walk around boulders & very minor things along the way.

    Maybe "The Last Remnant" is a better example of Square's prowess when it comes to at least exploring the idea of a non-linear story. It is also so difficult to win the battles, that its non-linear formula might be both a blessing and curse.



  • NevegaNevega Where's the Casino??? Full Members
    edited August 2010
    Just finished it last night (finally).

    I've never completed a game and simultainiously realized that the whole thing was really just a blur.

    The game gives me a similar feeling to when I watched that CGI Final Fantasy movie years back.

    And that's not good.
    CURRENTLY PLAYING:
    Grand Kingdom
    Xenoblade Chronicles X

  • RobbobRobbob New Member Full Members
    edited September 2010
    I don't really have a problem with it being "linear" - more the "on a rail" feeling. Even in X, you could backtrack if you wanted to. It was relatively pointless, but you could. You could spend time exploring a city and taking with the people. XIII did not have any of this.
  • shoptrollshoptroll Have towel will travel Full Members
    edited October 2010
    So long & thanks for all the fish!
  • ClixClix Former Listmaster Full Members
    edited October 2010
    So the team is fully aware that the West doesn't like linearity... Yeah, no way a focus group would help that late in the development. Hopefully this means they'll try more non-linearity techniques for FFXV.
  • SiliconNooBSiliconNooB Member Full Members
    edited October 2010
    Wow, small wonder it sucked so hard, they had no game design concept until they were forced to build the demo roughly a year before it shipped ...
    Lusipurr.com: One man's monument to himself!
    9 out of 10 Dentists recomend UNDERBOOB!
  • NergalNergal The Don Full Members
    edited October 2010
    MOAR Ivalice games plz!
  • SiliconNooBSiliconNooB Member Full Members
    edited October 2010
    @Nergal: You'll have to wait for Matsuno to finish Tactics Ogre for that, the only worthy Ivalice games have have him at the helm. I'm personally hoping for a follow up to Vagrant Story (perhaps with slightly more forgiving mechanics).

    That said, I am uncertain as to the extent that he's willing to get back into bed with SE after the corporate interference with FFXII's story.
    Lusipurr.com: One man's monument to himself!
    9 out of 10 Dentists recomend UNDERBOOB!
  • shoptrollshoptroll Have towel will travel Full Members
    edited October 2010
    So this excerpt basically makes the game a text-book example of "development hell". They really dropped the ball as a development team and honestly this was probably a bad project to try using "western development practices". You don't want to make sweeping changes to your workflow/process for the first time on a large scale project like this. Very bad call on the management side. I'm honestly surprised they managed to get the game out in 4 years. Seriously, it sounds like there was a lot of upheaval in the company as they try to adapt to changing conditions in the marketplace.

    Have they said how many other projects are using Crystal Tools? I know the Wii version of the engine was used in My Life as a King, but they've been really tight-lipped about where this engine is going. A shame really, for all the talked it up they're basically just doing the same-old same-old Japanese developer gig and they're probably going to use it as a one-off project and will scrap the engine and start from scratch on the next game. I was hoping they'd try licensing it to other companies like Epic or id, but I guess that's not in the cards. I wonder if they'll consider using an external engine for the next project based on their experience with developing Crystal Tools?

    I do worry about the current fascination with Western games and global appeal that seems to pervade this writeup. It's good they're paying attention to what Western gamers typically prefer, but I'm worried that companies like Square are going to eventually lose their identity/uniqueness if they are just trying to play copy-cat and fall flat at it in games like Front Mission Evolved or Mindjack. Given the recent string of high-profile games that didn't live up to expectations/standards, I'd rather they stick to what they're good at.
    So long & thanks for all the fish!
  • QuinQuin ne cede malis RPGamer Staff
    edited October 2010
    Trying to please everyone only pleases no-one. SE should go back to the roots of the J in JRPG.

    That said, I still preferred XIII to XII.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    befriend (v.): to use mecha-class beam weaponry to inflict grievous bodily harm on a target in the process of proving the validity of your belief system.
  • SiliconNooBSiliconNooB Member Full Members
    edited October 2010
    Ah, well there's no arguing with taste, but XII was a much better game.
    Lusipurr.com: One man's monument to himself!
    9 out of 10 Dentists recomend UNDERBOOB!
  • DravDrav A Serious Man Full Members
    edited October 2010
    So Tim Rogers was right after all?
  • Alex FullerAlex Fuller Managing Editor RPGamer Staff
    edited October 2010
    Quin wrote: »
    Trying to please everyone only pleases no-one. SE should go back to the roots of the J in JRPG.

    That said, I still preferred XIII to XII.

    Very much in agreement with that first bit (getting up to the point where most of my hopes are that tri-ace will come out with something soon). Trying way too much to gain the attention of people who just aren't interested and ending up with a mediocre mess that considerably less people want than they started with.

    Although personally XIII is making me think maybe XII wasn't as bad as I originally thought now. And all things considered that development process screw up doesn't sound remotely surprising.
    "Time is an illusion. Lunchtime doubly so."
    Twitter: severinmira | Xbox Live: Severin Mira | PSN: severinmira (EU) | NNID: severinmira
    Final Fantasy XIV: Sevvi Taubemira (Leviathan)
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