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Otterland's Xenosaga reader review

MetacodMetacod MemberFull Members
edited May 2003 in Site & Forum Support
I have to say, I've seen some really poorly done reviews, and the game Xenosaga seems to especially be a magnet for them, but Otterland's Xenosaga review was among the worst I've ever seen. mad.gif

Comments?



Comments

  • LordBrianLordBrian Member Full Members
    edited March 2003
    I'd have to agree, this truly is a terrible review in every sense of the word. But, that's what happens when you play the game for an hour and decide to write a review, gleaning what little opinions you can from places like the GameFAQs message boards.

    I'm almost tempted to pick the review apart piece by piece, but it hardly deserves so much attention. I'll just say this: when you play a game like Xenosaga, you're playing mainly for the story. When you skip the story, which he calls "quite excellent and elaborate" while being bored by it at the same time, then you are doing yourself, the game, and everyone who reads the review a grave injustice.

    And if he skipped all the cinematics as he claims to have done, then there's no way it took him 45 hours to beat the game. I'd esimate somewhere between 20-30, depending. But, again, you make that kind of mistake when you don't actually play the game.
  • KamikazeKamikaze Member Full Members
    edited March 2003
    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Metacod @ Mar. 23 2003,16:41)</td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"I have to say, I've seen some really poorly done reviews, and the game Xenosaga seems to especially be a magnet for them, but I have to say that Otterland's Xenosaga review was among the worst I've ever seen. mad.gif

    Comments?[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    Well I certainly hope you've emailed your grievances directly to the review writer. If I had more concern over the reviews in general I'd be doing just that.
  • yazarc420yazarc420 Member Full Members
    edited March 2003
    Hm. ?The way I look at it, reader submitted reviews are only written for 2 reasons. ?The person really loves a game and wants everyone to buy it, or they absolutely hate the game. ?I browse reader written reviews for the heck of it because it is often a good way to learn about how a games system works (providing it's more than a paragraph long). ?

    I don't even take the reviews at this website seriously (or any other publication) ?No offense to RPgamer when I say that ?smile.gif

    But it is irritating to see a review when it's obvious when a person hasn't played the game.

    When I look at the retroview for SaGa Frontier 2, I can see that the writer really lacks any experience with the series whatsoever.



  • LordBrianLordBrian Member Full Members
    edited March 2003
    While I haven't read the retroview in question, my personal opinion is that you don't need to have experience with a series to write a review for a game. Unless Game Y is significantly related to Game X (like Malignant Mutation will be to Infection in the .hack series), the rest of the series shouldn't have any bearing on any specific game. Because of this, a review of FFX shouldn't compare the game to any previous Final Fantasy. It doesn't matter if it does things differently, or does them the same; it's a stand alone game, even with the same title, and should be treated as such. The same goes for SF2.
  • The AthenianThe Athenian Member Full Members
    edited April 2003
    I agree, this review doesn't deserve any attention whatsoever.
    ...But I'm feeling generous! ? wink.gif ? It's Fiery Sword of Justice time again, and today's special is barbecued otter.

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"But of course, this is a review concerning a Xenosaga game, namely episode one, "Der Wille zur Macht," meaning "The Will to Power" ("The Will to *the* Power," if you"re Canadian), a subtitle coming from a Nietzsche poem.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    I'm Canadian, and I don't call it "The Will to the Power". ?Does anyone know what the heck Otterland is trying to say, here? ?...And did Nietzsche write poems?

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"Yes, it is turn-based, and though it be this way, it was simply not all that good. Yes, there is a meter in the lower right-hand corner of the screen to see who gets to attack next, a la "Final Fantasy X," but this meter ain't all that good, I should say. Firstly, it runs out, and whoever or whatever attacks at the end of the bar should pray to God that one among their ranks, whether it be monster or good guy, gets to attack next; the same goes for healing, a common gripe by me with turn-based RPGs. More of this battle system, each character attacks right after you input their commands, which come in combos, numbering from one to three, three you can get by charging up your AP meter by simply defending. This may seem to work quite well, but wait till you get to the Boost! Yes, the Boost, where any enemy or ally can suddenly jump into the turn order bar and wreak whatever hell he, she, or it desires.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    Um... okay, so Otterland told us that there was turn meter, and that there was something called "Boost" that affected it. ?Why is this a bad thing, again?
    Otterland is doing that thing that really bad reviewers often do -- you know, where they simply describe the game mechanics to you, and then assume you think the same way they do and can figure out why it is so horrible.

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"On the bright side, the graphics are quite excellent, all characters being depicted to scale, as are the monsters.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    "All the characters being depicted to scale"?! ?What the heck is this? ?I feel like I just stepped into another dimension where games are evaluated according to arbitrary and unimportant characteristics. ?I imagine Metal Gear Solid gets a good mark for its interesting box art, but loses points because Solid Snake had a mullet.

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"Need I say any more, folks? Yeah, that's right, shut up.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    Is he talking to himself? ?...Or is he telling the readers to shut up? ?I hope other critics don't start following this method: ?"Ebert and Roper told you to shut up and see this movie!" ?And later, "Leonard Maltin gives you the finger, because Vin Diesel is to scale!"

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"Perhaps you'll get 80 or more if you watch all the movies completely (I skipped over them all, getting a tad bit bored)[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    Didn't like the gameplay. ?Didn't like the story. ?Didn't like the music or interface. ?WHY is this guy still playing the game?! ?...Oh yeah, the characters were "to scale."

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"Yes, one can say that the menus are quite easy to navigate, unless you make one little mistake in selecting an option, which can really frustrate you given that it's slow as heck to navigate. Furthermore, you have to go to your characters' statuses in order to equip them, and the whole equipment system of the game, I should say, is quite flawed, in the sense that you can't tell how any weapons or armor affect the stats of your characters or AGWS (pronounced "eggs," this game's equivalent of Gears, large robots a la Voltron) before you buy them, like in many other RPGs.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    Translation: "The menus are easy to navigate, but I am clumsy and hit the wrong buttons a lot. ?Also, I cannot figure out this complex equipment sytem, whereby equipment simply gets better as it gets more expensive, just like in most other games."

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"As for localization, I'll assume the worst, given that this *is* a Namco RPG, after all. Just look at how they localized "Tales of Destiny" and "Tales of Destiny II" (called "Tales of Eternia" in Japan, but since the He-man creators already owned the name Eternia, that could be a perfectly legitimate title change). Cripes, Namco of Japan should let other people localize their games.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    Oh, for cryin' out loud. ?Why does he have to "assume" how the translation is? ?I'd be quite embarrassed if I wrote this kamikaze hack job. ?Cripes, Otterland should let other people write his reviews. ?After all, he obviously let other people play his games.

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"As for originality, I'll assume very well that it's original, given that it doesn't seem to rip off of any other RPG (not even Xenogears, at that), although its plot, which is quite excellent and elaborate, I should say, bears a little resemblance with a certain classic science fiction film which won't be mentioned, which is why I halved the points for originality.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    Oh, how clever -- he says he will not mention the title of the movie, but then actually provides a link to something regarding 2001: A Space Odyssey. ?Let's take a look at all the similarities between Xenosaga and 2001, shall we?

    1. Both stories have large monoliths in them.
    2. Both are stories that Otterland probably has experienced at least a few minutes of.
    3. Both take place in outer space.
    4. That's basically it. ?Shut up.

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"I could've learned more if I watched the other cinema scenes, but I'll not bore you.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    No, it's alright! ?We don't mind! ?Please, "bore" us with a worthwhile opinion for once!

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"Heck, even if you liked Xenogears, you're not missing anything, plot-wise, for that matter.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    How is it that Otterland can skip all the cutscenes (so as not to bore us), and still know how the plot goes?
    Also, I've been all the way through Xenogears several times. ?I'm getting near the end of Xenosaga, finally, and I must say that I have no idea what the heck is going on anymore, nor how exactly any of its events tie in with those of Xenogears.

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"Battle System -- 1
    Interface -- 1
    Music & Sound -- 1
    Originality -- 5
    Story -- 10
    Localization -- 1
    Replay Value -- 0
    Visuals -- 10[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    What a spoiled little brat. ?Otterland must be used to playing some pretty amazing games if Xenosaga got 1's for battle system, interface, localization, and music. ?How can anything even get a zero at all, for replay value? ?I don't care how bad it is, it can't possibly get a zero.
    The most impressive visuals occur during the cutscenes, wouldn't you say? ?Why, I'll bet if Otterland saw those, he'd give Xenosaga a 39 for visuals, at least!
    Actually, I'm surprised he was even able to give out that one mark of 5 for originality. ?I didn't think he knew how to give any marks besides ones and tens.

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"I'm almost tempted to pick the review apart piece by piece, but it hardly deserves so much attention.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    Oh, LordBrian, why didn't I listen to you?

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"Well I certainly hope you've emailed your grievances directly to the review writer.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    I doubt that would do any good. ?I'd probably get back an angry reply with threats to sue me or hack into my computer, or perhaps death by karate or something.



  • OmegaOmega Member Full Members
    edited April 2003
    Although i know it took a lot of work..thank you Athenian for making Otterland look like the fool he is with that horrid review...Much repsect from Xeno Fans!!
  • The AthenianThe Athenian Member Full Members
    edited April 2003
    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"Although i know it took a lot of work..thank you Athenian for making Otterland look like the fool he is with that horrid review...Much repsect from Xeno Fans!![/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    Oh, it's not work at all -- it's a labour of love! biggrin.gif
  • The GeneralThe General Member Full Members
    edited April 2003
    much funniness.

    how anyone expects their review to be taken seriously when they're "assuming" things is beyond me. sarcasm.gif
  • LordBrianLordBrian Member Full Members
    edited April 2003
    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"Oh, LordBrian, why didn't I listen to you?[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>

    Boredom, I guess. laugh.gif
  • PhospheneHereticPhospheneHeretic Member Full Members
    edited April 2003
    Someone ought to send that fellow a link to Parish's review. Whereas I disagree very much with Parish, the review is fabulously constructed. Of course, Otter would probably get confused after the first paragraph, but you know, que sera sera.
  • Options
    edited April 2003
    While I do agree with Otter on his overall view of the game ( I myself disliked the game, took it back after I beat it, something I almost never do with RPG's ) I think he could have made an attempt to pass his sophomore English class before he wrote the review.

    Honestly, if you want to express your viewpoint in a professional manner, at least try to -sound- intelligent when you do it.
  • GlacianGlacian Member Full Members
    edited April 2003
    I agree...that was an awful review. This is why I don't pay attention to "reader reviews." They're almost always very biased.
  • MonCapitan2002MonCapitan2002 Avatar Captured Full Members
    edited April 2003
    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (The Athenian @ April 01 2003,00:10)</td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"I'm almost tempted to pick the review apart piece by piece, but it hardly deserves so much attention.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    Oh, LordBrian, why didn't I listen to you?[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    I'm glad you took the time to pick apart his review. ?It was an excellent critique. ?You should do it more often.
    LordBilbanes.png
    Please help my city grow. Estharopolis - Population | Industry | Transportation | Security | Environment | Business
  • Options
    edited April 2003
    "large robots a la Voltron"

    That says it all. tounge.gif
  • MetacodMetacod Member Full Members
    edited April 2003
    Well, there are some new Otterland reviews up on RPGamer today. The FF10 one is particularly funny (in a forehead-slapping sort of way). Every score is a ten, besides Replay Value, which is (you guessed it) a 0. The review text itself also contains some "What the $%#%" moments, like the gramatically bizarre first two sentences:
    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"Ah, yes, we all know Squaresoft's Final Fantasy series, from its humble roots on the Nintendo Entertainment System to this title, the latest in the series, on the PlayStation 2. It was certainly back then a far cry from the Dragon Warrior series, being with better graphics and such, and here in the States, it would most certainly outsell the Dragon Warrior series, and do so by a little in its homeland of Japan.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    and this description of the music, which is funny enought that I don't even need to apply adjectives to it:
    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"Yes, the music in the Final Fantasy series is quite good, bearing either a somewhat-classical theme or a modern pop disposition. Still, the music is quite memorable,[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    eh.gif
  • CastomelCastomel Member Full Members
    edited April 2003
    All right, kids... Are we quite done here? Otterland doesn't go around picking everything you write to bits, so do him the same courtesy and email him your objections rather than posting them here to humiliate him.
    Whoa! Slow down there, tubby! You're not on the moon yet!
  • LordBrianLordBrian Member Full Members
    edited April 2003
    If it appears on the site, do people not have the right to respectfully discuss what part(s) of it they like? By the same token, then, don't they have the right to respectfully discuss what they dislike about it? I don't see anything here that flames Otterland, unless you consider the very pointing out of how ridiculous his reviews are as flaming. Which I don't.

    Sending the author of the review is all well and good, but the point of the RPGamer discussion board is to discuss the content we put up on the site. That content isn't limited to news and media, or pop-ups and missing pages. RPGamer is also a community site, and the boards are a place for that community to discuss what its members are doing. So let them discuss.
  • CastomelCastomel Member Full Members
    edited April 2003
    ... I'm not suggesting that discussing the work of others has no place on this board, but you have to admit this has gone on for a fairly lengthy bit of time with nothing new added to the proceedings other than "OMG sux0rs!".

    That's my problem with this thread; you're just repeating the same thing over and over again. Fine. His reviews blow. I think the examples provided here are adequate proof of that, and unless there's some marked change in that status, then why bother continuing to expound on that?

    If that floats your boat, then by all means, continue... I just don't understand this need to belittle others to excess here. Stupidity remains stupid even if you don't point it out, and doing so certainly doesn't make you any smarter than you were before you did.
    Whoa! Slow down there, tubby! You're not on the moon yet!
  • LordBrianLordBrian Member Full Members
    edited April 2003
    I'm not claiming otherwise, on any of those points. However, if I were to close every thread when it came to the point where nothing new was said and everything was a repeat of something that came before, I'd have to close 90% of the open threads. tounge.gif

    And for the record, most of the negative comments in this thread are focused entirely on the review in question, showing that people can critique someone's work without stooping to personal insults. And as long as RPGamer's official reviews are open to bashing as long as people feel the need to do so, so shall reader reviews.
  • MetacodMetacod Member Full Members
    edited April 2003
    I admit I was kind of off-topic on my last post, and I doubt anyone has anything new to say about Otterland's Xenosaga review. I certainly don't, but if you want to keep the thread open, go ahead.
  • The AthenianThe Athenian Member Full Members
    edited April 2003
    I'm sorry, I couldn't resist. I wasn't planning on bashing Otterland anymore, because as I read the FFX review I realized that these things were actually quite funny and I didn't want to discourage such hilarious antics. But, then I read the one for the first gameboy SaGa game... and that was it. I cracked. I just HAD to point out a few of my favorite moments from Otterland's new unintentional-comedy series:

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"I'm reviewing, of course, the remake of the game, released unfortunately for the Wonderswan Color from Bandai, a portable system that never made it to America. I managed to get my hands on one, courtesy of my local importer, and got myself a few games. Makaitoushi Saga, as you shall see, is worth importing a Wonderswan, hence the title of my optimistic review of this delightful title.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    The title of the review is Import Yourself a Wonderswan Color Today (Get Me One, Too). Strange... I guess Otterland wants to have two Wonderswan Colors. Also, a note to Otterland: We're supposed to be reading about a game, not the person who's playing it.

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"I'll admit here and now that when I played my very first SaGa game, "SaGa Frontier" on the Sony PlayStation, I got a bit disillusioned from the series[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    Being "disillusioned" suggests that you once loved it, but based on new a new perspective or knowledge, you now see it in a less-than-flattering light and are disappointed with it. You cannot be "disillusioned from the series" by your first experience of it.

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"The music and sound are gloriously reproduced in the game, and they are ear candy, plain and simple as that.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    Um... okay, so Otterland liked the music. But, is it just me or does the phrase "ear candy" have a distinctively negative context? When people talk about a game being "eye candy," they often suggest that the gameplay suffers because of the pretty graphics. But, I suppose that it just means that Otterland liked the music. ...which he says absolutely nothing about, by the way. He doesn't even mention if they are upgraded from the original gameboy version, so we just have to assume that they are -- or that he is madly in love with the sound quality of a gameboy.

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"The graphics, too, are quite a step up from this game's predecessor, as they all of course are in glorious color[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    Number of times something has been called glorious within a span of two sentences: Two.

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"The interface of this game is okay, and menus are easy to navigate.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    Hmmm... moderately approving of the game... fills up space within the text of the review... and yet it says absolutely nothing!


    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"If you want to heal, pray to God that your healing gets in first.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"you can't tell the strength of weapons and armor before you buy them, making you pray to God before you buy them that they're better than your current equipment.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    Number of times you are told to pray to God within a single review: Two.

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"Of course, this game has no localization, though I could enter my characters' names (Jeremy, Lufia, Michael, and Rizzo, as you can see in the battle shot) courtesy of my good friend Katakana.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    Well, thanks for that bit of insight. This point just makes me wonder... who the heck is this review for? Otter is talking about localization here, which is a concept that does not even exist because it is a Japanese-only game. And yet, the review is in English, on an RPG site that is also in English. I can only come to the conclusion that the purpose of this review is to brag to the English-speaking gaming community that Otterland has imported a Wonderswan Color and a few games, and that he knows Katakana.

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"Yes, this game is quite original, and yes, it does a plot, which guarantees both top marks.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    Apparently, in order to receive a 10 for originality, a game must be "quite original." And in order to receive a 10 for Story & Plot, it must simply have one -- or "do" one, rather.

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"I personally could care less about plot and originality of RPGs, since too much of both can really divert attention away from the solid gameplay experience you can sometimes get from games like this, which I most certainly did, thank you very much.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    uh... you're welcome?
    Anyway, that's one interesting point of view -- that originality detracts from gameplay. Some day I hope I can play a game made by Otterland Software, which will be a complete rip-off of other games with solid gameplay that you can "sometimes get."

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"In conclusion, import yourself a Wonderswan Color today just to get your paws on this excellent remake, and yes, don't forget another one for me too, and though the portable system is pretty much dead, you won't regret your investment![/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    Once again, I'd like to mention that Otterland ALREADY HAS a Wonderswan Color. Apparently, buying a dead console for yourself and someone you don't even know is a wise investment, because of a ten-hour-long Japanese remake of an ancient gameboy game.

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"However, if it's plots you're in to?avoid this game like the plague.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    Again, I will mention that Otter gave it a 10 for Story & Plot.

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"If you want a game with only plot and no gameplay, by all means, get Xenosaga.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    Wow, what a suitable conclusion to the review. Inexplicably bashing another game entirely -- classy!
  • knightofhyruleknightofhyrule Member Full Members
    edited May 2003
    So he's against originality? If he does a .Hack review, I might just do a little critique of my own.
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