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RPGamer's Donation Campaign

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Comments

  • MeoTwister5MeoTwister5 Member Full Members
    edited May 2004
    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Rico @ May 28 2004,05:40)</td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"If I had a choice between paying ten or twenty bucks for a half-assed game and just donating the money and having the people available to actually work on the site more, I'd pick the latter. ?There're enough people on the Internet that think they can make a game that offer them for free if I'm feeling masochistic, and if I want to spend $20, I'll go pick up a used game.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    Precisely.

    Even if it's for a "good cause", most people would use the cash on something better even if it goes to the pockets of some "greedy corporate entity."

    Bah. That's human nature for you.
  • RicoRico Member Full Members
    edited May 2004
    Yeah, sure?.?.?.?if you skip the part in my post where I say it's better to give them money straight out just for their work on the site.

    Human nature could use some reading comprehension.
  • DracosDracos Member Full Members
    edited May 2004
    To Roku:

    'Whoopie'. Rico's response clearly points out the deal. Doing anything other than a half-assed deal takes time that's better spent on the site.

    Dracos
  • O Shrouded OneO Shrouded One Hobo With A Huge Heart Full Members
    edited May 2004
    geez, let Roku be, he was just making a suggestion. it's not like he's demanding anything or saying if you don't agree you're going to hell, it was just an idea. after all, Kamikaze asked for suggestions, no matter how elaborate or impossible they may seem. he just used his knowledge of what we have and created an idea based of that. so relax or I'll have to get out the knife
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  • ParnParn Member Full Members
    edited May 2004
    Donations campaigns work or they fail, depending on the kind of userbase they attract.

    RPGFan has survived off of both advertisements and donations for two or three years now, so it's living proof that it can be done. Penny Arcade is another example, though donations lead to exclusive content.

    I don't understand this idea that RPGamer needs to either go subscription or throw in the towel. That's idiocy. If the donation drive manages to fail somehow, fine. That doesn't mean it's time to call it quits. Good grief.
  • Lucid DreamerLucid Dreamer Banned Banned Users
    edited May 2004
    Yeah. Maybe Mikel should ask other folks how they get by without shelling out money from their own personal cofffers.

    Btw: Parn, if one was to donate to Rpgfan would you give it to John? Im fuzzy on who was in control there.
  • DracosDracos Member Full Members
    edited May 2004
    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (O' Shrouded One @ May 28 2004,17:26)</td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"geez, let Roku be, he was just making a suggestion. ?it's not like he's demanding anything or saying if you don't agree you're going to hell, it was just an idea. ?after all, Kamikaze asked for suggestions, no matter how elaborate or impossible they may seem. ?he just used his knowledge of what we have and created an idea based of that. ?so relax or I'll have to get out the knife[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    You may surmise from the beginning of my response that it's one that gets trotted out every so often, never with any though behind what it entails. This naturally makes it an annoying thing to see. Instead perhaps of spending the time writing it, lauding it, defending it, and etc... you could spend an equal time in 'thinking over what this would mean and it's use', and thus save effective strategies to get posted in a thread of concern.

    Dracos
  • DracosDracos Member Full Members
    edited May 2004
    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Parn @ May 29 2004,08:10)</td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"Donations campaigns work or they fail, depending on the kind of userbase they attract.

    RPGFan has survived off of both advertisements and donations for two or three years now, so it's living proof that it can be done. ?Penny Arcade is another example, though donations lead to exclusive content.

    I don't understand this idea that RPGamer needs to either go subscription or throw in the towel. ?That's idiocy. ?If the donation drive manages to fail somehow, fine. ?That doesn't mean it's time to call it quits. ?Good grief.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    You know, I was thinking of bringing up PA, but there's some notable problems in leaping from the 'PA did it and survived, therefore it's a valid long term strategy'. ?First off, PA left that strategy as soon as they could afford to. ?While they demonstrated it could work, it was not an intelligent long term way to run a business, and since they were interested in surviving long term, they weren't going to rely on it any more than they had to. ?Secondly, PA did it years ago, when advertising was looked at a lot more lucratively than it is now. ?PA currently holds what would be considered to be a special position as far as that goes, with detailed stats and a very strong past history to show companies, allowing them to get better rates than most sites in that regard. ?Thirdly, they don't just rely on such things. ?They've had a store since forever, one that's usually hammered with purchases and visits. ?They do a great deal of side business, special deals, and other things. ?The time since they lasted on just donations and ads passed years ago.

    As I recall, there's also been demonstrated examples that RPGamer has to deal with significantly larger traffic than RPGFan, making solutions that worked for them not necessarily viable for RPGamer. ?Not saying I don't agree with the fact that there are more options, a store being one of them, but that neither example is particularly good in justifying the success possibility of going just donation/ad. ?Particularly not with trying to reach a rather large initial donation goal.

    EDIT: And really, looking at the success rate so far, the user base comment may be right here. I'm somewhat surprised at the turnout so far given the reputed thousands that drop by this site daily.

    Dracos



  • FiremystFiremyst Daddy Dragon II Full Members
    edited May 2004
    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Parn @ May 29 2004,08:10)</td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"I don't understand this idea that RPGamer needs to either go subscription or throw in the towel. That's idiocy. If the donation drive manages to fail somehow, fine. That doesn't mean it's time to call it quits. Good grief.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    I'm not sure where this is coming from... is this a response to a post on the boards? I tried to make it as clear as possible that this isn't a do or die situation. There are a number of drastic improvements we need to get done this year, but if the donation campaign fails (as it seems to be doing...), then we'll have to try something else.

    Just because we're not do or die doesn't mean we're not serious about needing the money. If donations fail, we'll have to find ways to either cut down bandwidth usage, server usage, or something... I didn't actually think it would fail, so I'm unsure of our next step.

    If people would rather buy t-shirts, mugs, etc than straight donations, I can understand that. The number of transactions required to make the same amount of money increases greatly, but definately possible. How is cafepress' handiwork? Is it quality stuff? They seem to be the popular choice.
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  • DracosDracos Member Full Members
    edited May 2004
    I used Cafepress before for about a week before switching to a different company. The quality of their stuff was poor in general and the amount of overhead they demanded up front was higher than I found through other providers. To turn a half decent profit for a simple shirt generally involved charging quite a bit (they eat at least the first 15-20 last I saw). You'd likely be better checking with other highly popular sites that have shirt/knickknack stores to see what deals they've been able to garner. I know Sluggy has close ties with a company to do this. 8-bit relies on some rocket-ninja company (never done business with them myself). Penny arcade recently arranged for some other company to handle their store, but I don't recall the name at the moment (colo something I think). Better to talk to a company that specializes in it, will recognize the size of the potential audience, and give you a decent deal rather than work through cafe press, in any case.

    Dracos
  • CainEJWCainEJW Member Full Members
    edited May 2004
    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Parn @ May 29 2004,10:10)</td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"I don't understand this idea that RPGamer needs to either go subscription or throw in the towel. ?That's idiocy. ?If the donation drive manages to fail somehow, fine. ?That doesn't mean it's time to call it quits. ?Good grief.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    As Mikel replied, we have made it blazingly clear that RPGamer will survive with or without these donations. With them the site can get hardware improvements quicker. Without them, we'll just stay where we are and try to improve with what we're given.

    RPGamer will survive without donations. Your donations are simply making things happen quicker than it would normally. Nothing more.
  • MageoftheSandsMageoftheSands Member Full Members
    edited May 2004
    I'm just glad that it's a small graphic out in the middle of nowhere.
  • ParnParn Member Full Members
    edited May 2004
    Before more staff decides to misinterpret my post:

    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"I think its time for RPGamer to mature, or face the music and die off, because begging is only going to speed up that process.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>

    My post was in response to the very first post in the thread. I'm well aware that RPGamer has no intention of disappearing.
  • DracosDracos Member Full Members
    edited June 2004
    There happens to be a game development forum here that remarkably gets extremely little traffic.

    Dracos
    Is blunt with the hints
  • Options
    edited June 2004
    Where did my post go?
  • KamikazeKamikaze Member Full Members
    edited June 2004
    It was probably deleted. Since your post should have been made in the Game Development forum, I guess a moderator thought best to...delete your post. If the moderator did not inform you of why this happened, then the new regime is already showing its faults.

    What should have happened (in my opinion):

    a.) Your post deleted and a PM sent to inform you of why, and the appropriate place to post.

    or

    b.) Your post edited to inform you of where you should have posted.

    or

    c.) You post left intact, and either a reply or PM sent informing you of where you should post.

    In my opinion, the latter two would have been preferable, since it serves as an example to other board members.
  • CainEJWCainEJW Member Full Members
    edited June 2004
    Kamikaze, I would heavily suggest you not think this is my doing. In fact, it is a surprise to you as it is to me this was deleted without prior warning. I've sent out guidelines that basically, to every effect, say that deletion is never the first alternative. I've said it countless times to those who ask about deletion: "Deletion is always the last alternative available, never use it first." Unless the post is basically a spam post after editing, the edit is the first alternative.

    I do know which moderator did it and I will be speaking with them very shortly. Next time, Kamikaze, how about you let those with access to the knowledge speak instead of speaking for them.
  • Lucid DreamerLucid Dreamer Banned Banned Users
    edited June 2004
    Heil.

    Edit: You should just ban me now. I can already tell that there are going to be problems. Just get it out of the way.



  • madhtrmadhtr Full Member Full Members
    edited June 2004
    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Lucid Dreamer @ June 08 2004,11:53)</td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"Heil.

    Edit: You should just ban me now. I can already tell that there are going to be problems. Just get it out of the way.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    You're a very strange person....... Were you offended by Cain saying he didn't understand why the mod did what they did and that he would talk to them?
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  • Options
    edited June 2004
    Ok then.... I will just re-post it in the Game Development section sometime. It's just someone brought up the idea of selling an RPG created by the staff on this site so I figured I would chime in with my plans to design one. Oh well biggrin.gif
  • CainEJWCainEJW Member Full Members
    edited June 2004
    jared, we welcome your post just it wasn't suited to this forum. Go ahead and post it in development. The mod in question has been reprimanded and all staff may not delete a post without asking me first. I do not tolerate removal of post.

    As for you, Dreamer, if you're looking for drama I'm the wrong person to try it with. Others may have tolerated high school antics for some ideal that you deserve to be here, but I will not. You do not deserve to be here, you elect to be here. To be here you follow our rules, and you agree to do so when you enter. If you have a problem with that, then the problem is with your agreement, not with our rules which have existed for years. If you do not wish to be here, simply close the window. I will not ban you because you cannot control your snide comments.
  • Options
    edited June 2004
    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (CainEJW @ June 08 2004,10:45)</td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"jared, we welcome your post just it wasn't suited to this forum.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    It's not a problem. Live and learn smile.gif
  • KamikazeKamikaze Member Full Members
    edited June 2004
    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (CainEJW @ June 08 2004,08:49)</td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"Kamikaze, I would heavily suggest you not think this is my doing. In fact, it is a surprise to you as it is to me this was deleted without prior warning. I've sent out guidelines that basically, to every effect, say that deletion is never the first alternative. I've said it countless times to those who ask about deletion: "Deletion is always the last alternative available, never use it first." Unless the post is basically a spam post after editing, the edit is the first alternative.

    I do know which moderator did it and I will be speaking with them very shortly. Next time, Kamikaze, how about you let those with access to the knowledge speak instead of speaking for them.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    Although I placed most of the blame on the moderator, the admin of the forums is indeed responsible for the actions that they take. My intent was not to speak for them or yourself, but to point out a very obvious fault in action taken by a moderator. I've had experience moderating here, so I thought my insight would be welcome. It seems you've resolved the situation though, so I'll just move along,
  • Lucid DreamerLucid Dreamer Banned Banned Users
    edited June 2004
    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (madhtr @ June 08 2004,09:34)</td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Lucid Dreamer @ June 08 2004,11:53)</td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"Heil.

    Edit: You should just ban me now. I can already tell that there are going to be problems. Just get it out of the way.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    You're a very strange person....... Were you offended by Cain saying he didn't understand why the mod did what they did and that he would talk to them?[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    I was offended by the manner in which he said it. It wasn't as...(to make things simple) nice as you make it out to be.
  • madhtrmadhtr Full Member Full Members
    edited June 2004
    </span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (Lucid Dreamer @ June 09 2004,22:26)</td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote (madhtr @ June 08 2004,09:34)</td></tr><tr><td class="QUOTE"
    Heil.

    Edit: You should just ban me now. I can already tell that there are going to be problems. Just get it out of the way.
    <span id='postcolor'>
    You're a very strange person....... Were you offended by Cain saying he didn't understand why the mod did what they did and that he would talk to them?[/quote]
    I was offended by the manner in which he said it. It wasn't as...(to make things simple) nice as you make it out to be.[/QUOTE]<span id='postcolor'>
    Yeah, he could have worded his statement a little better but he is an admin of the forums so eventhough you may not like it, there's no point in getting that upset about it. All you needed to do was mention why you had a problem and that would have sufficed unless i'm mistaken.

    I wasn't trying to make it sound like he was saying it was said in a nice way but i was only mentioning that there's no point in getting upset over it.
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  • CainEJWCainEJW Member Full Members
    edited June 2004
    You see it as rude, I see it as stern. Either way, this thread needs to get back on topic now. Anything below this post that is off topic will be removed.
  • Matt1plus1Matt1plus1 Member Full Members
    edited July 2004
    I really like the idea of merchandising, I'd love to get my grubby hands on some RPGamer stuff.

    I also think the compilation of Sound Test stuff would be really cool too, and I think there are a couple of loopholes to the whole copyright issue. Not sure on this though, but maybe it could be set up so if you buy a certain amount's worth of stuff ($25? $50?), you get the CD free. That way the seller isn't profiting from the sale of the music, or whatever. Just a thought, although that would mean you could only sign on the remixers who were willing to do it royalty-free.

    And beyond that, maybe another neat idea would be a sort of "art book" featuring submissions from the fanart collection? You could make several actually, some based on game series, or others artistic styles (all CG, all pencil-sketch, etc). I see lots of marketable potential in RPGamer. ;)

    So personally this fund-raiser doesen't bother me one bit. Though I do think there would be some more creative ways to go about making money so that everyone is satisfied.
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